EARTH Theories

HOLLOW EARTH
John Fiala interview 9/6/17
_John was involved in a radiometric dating experiment during college. A live mollusc shell was dated by Carbon-14 and Potassium-Argon methods. I think John said the latter dated the shell correctly, but the former dated it as 1200 years old. I need to ask John if he remembers correctly, because what I've read indicates that C-14 dating is usually very close to correct, while K/Ar etc are usually way off.
_John's father invented the first gravitometer.
_John was involved in ULF Doppler experiments that suggest that the Earth is hollow.

---

Doug Ettinger ettingerjournals.com
See my paper "Earth's Metamorphosis (EM) Hypothesis" and "The Great Deluge: Fact or Fiction". References: D.S Allan & J.B. Delair of 'Cataclysm'; Walt Brown of 'In the Beginning'; and Zecharia Sitchin of 'The Twelfth Planet'

The continental cratons that date back to 3.6 bya are the remaining melted rock of the original mega-continent. This date roughly agrees with the dating of the LHB (Late Heavy Bombardment) of the solar system which was caused mostly by the Earth's major impact. Primitive life began about 2.9 bya on Earth when the molten continents cooled and the steaming atmosphere condensed once again to form new oceans, and further meteorite strikes diminished. The surrounding orbital region was finally swept clean of debris from Earth's major impact as attested by dating of the oldest rocks of the mares on the Moon. As explained in the "Earth's Metamorphosis Hypothesis" the energy of the Earth's impactor was expended by tilting the Earth and displacing its orbit from between Jupiter and Mars (the Main Belt region) to share an existing orbit with the so-called Moon. This hypothesis answers the mystery of the Moon Enigma: how can two planets share the same orbit?

F: Currently agreeing with the Electric Universe concepts and adding "supernova seeding" where balls of plasma and cooling debris are flung into other existing star systems.
C: Earth sustained a major impact that penetrated and expanded the Earth's mantle diameter thereby cracking the existing oceanic crust of basaltic rock. From the impact crater flowed a mixture of volatile materials from both the impactor and the Earth's mantle to create a mega-continent of lighter granitic rock. Due to the thicker newly formed continental crust, an imbalance of the spinning crustal materials above the Moho layer caused the mega continent to split apart and drift into the thinner oceanic crust. The continents continue to hunt for equilibrium, but much less in current times.
S: Sedimentary rock strata was caused at various times down through the ages ever since the Great Impact due to a combination of secondary differentiation from the volatiles trapped inside the Earth's mantle and plate tectonics caused by the original crustal cracking. Many of the impactor's volatiles (similar to an icy Ganymede) were ejected through volcanoes and ocean rifts; this is the origin of the almost infinite methane reservoirs still found under the current deep rock layers.
O: Plate tectonics and various changes in the Earth's geoid at random times caused by close encounters of other magnetized celestial bodies. This mantle shifting is explained in my paper, "The Great Deluge: Fact or Fiction".
GL: Glaciation is a planetary cycling process similar to what happens with the CO2 Martian Ice Caps. The ice sheets melt thereby increasing ocean surface which in turn increases condensation, cloud cover, and repeated cooling to re-create ice sheets. Of course, glaciation is complicated by Mikovitch cycles, continental drift, geoid changes, and fouling of atmosphere due to increased random volcanism.

RE: Do I have your model right?
Wednesday, January 3, 2018 8:27 PM
From: "James Maxlow" <james.maxlow@bigpond.com>
To: "'lloyd kinder'" <lkindr@yahoo.com> davidn@aoi.com.au
_Hi Lloyd, I have been mulling over your questions etc. but don't feel like I am getting through. Firstly, while I am tagged with Expansion Tectonic theory, the research that I present in my books and current manuscript is focussed on modelling factual global tectonic data independently of any preferred theory or concept. The research has been totally focussed on letting the data tell its own story and hence is empirical science. My emphasis to the group has been, although I don't always get it across to them, that any theory must be compatible with the empirical modelling data. The fact that this empirical modelling favours Expansion Tectonics is therefore very supportive of this theory. Secondly, geology is not cut and dry, as you appear to be attempting to portray. None of your answers to the questions below are correct, as again attested by the global data modelling, so I will go through and reword them for you. Regarding glaciation, you should be able to piece together something from the postings I have sent recently i.e. there have been five major glacial events. The following is an extract from my manuscript.
_"There have been at least five major ice ages in the Earth's geological past, referred to as the Huronian, Cryogenian, Andean-Saharan, and Karoo ice ages, and the current Quaternary glaciation. Outside these ages, the Earth was ice-free even in high latitudes.
_Glacial related rocks from the earliest, well established, Huronian ice age formed around 2.4 to 2.1 billion years ago during the early-Proterozoic Eon. The next well-documented Cryogenian ice age, suggested as being the most severe, occurred from 850 to 630 million years ago during the late-Proterozoic. It has been suggested by others that the end of this ice age was responsible for the subsequent late-Proterozoic and Cambrian explosion of life forms, athough this suggestion is controversial. The Andean-Saharan ice age occurred from 460 to 420 million years ago during the late-Ordovician and Silurian Periods. The Karoo ice age occurred at intervals from 360 to 260 million years ago in South Africa during the Carboniferous and early-Permian Periods. Correlatives are also known from Argentina within the ancient supercontinent Gondwana.
_The current ice age, the Quaternary glaciation, started about 2.58 million years ago during the late-Pliocene when the spread of ice sheets in the Northern Hemisphere began, although an ice cap began forming much earlier on Antarctica some 33 million years ago. Since then, the Earth has seen cycles of glaciation with ice sheets advancing and retreating on 40,000 to 100,000 year time scales. The Earth is currently in an interglacial period and the last glacial period ended about 10,000 years ago. All that remains of the present glaciation is the Greenland and Antarctic ice sheets and smaller glaciers such as on Baffin Island, Canada, and various mountain glaciers."
_Okay, question 1C. How and when did the largely granitic/sedimentary continents and the largely basaltic ocean basins form?
_The largely granitic/sedimentary primordial (supercontinental) continental crusts initially formed around 4000 million years ago. The primordial granitic cratonic crusts were formed first once surface cooling was low enough to allow crystallisation of the primitive minerals and rocks. As the surface area increased during increase in earth radius the primitive continental sediments accumulated in low-lying  continental basins. The oldest dated sediments are around 3.9 billion years old. Accumulation of continental sediments continued throughout the Precambrian and Palaeozoic times until the continental crusts ruptured to form the modern continents and opened to form the modern seas at around 250 million years ago. The basaltic ocean basins commenced opening from around 250 million years ago and have continued opening and increasing in surface area to the present.
_The answer to your question then is that, on an increasing radius Earth, the modern continents have only existed in their current form since breakup of the ancient Pangaean super-continental crust commenced some 250 million years ago. These modern continents represent the fragmented remains of the ancient Pangaea supercontinental crustal shell. Fragmentation and breakup of Pangaea occurred because the ability of the supercontinental crusts to continue to stretch and extend during on-going increases in Earth surface area was exceeded during late-Permian times. Once crustal stretching was exceeded the Pangaean supercontinental crust then ruptured, broke apart and fragmented to form the modern continents and opened to form the intervening modern oceans. Opening of the modern oceans then exposed the basaltic mantle rocks to form the modern, largely basaltic, ocean basins, i.e. the modern ocean basins represent exposed and quenched mantle rocks.
_2S. How and when did sedimentary rock strata form?
_Sediments are the by-product of weathering and erosion of exposed pre-existing rocks. The oldest known sedimentary rock is dated at around 3.91 billion years old. Sedimentary rocks occur throughout earth history and are continuing to form today. Throughout earth history though the type and distribution of sediments have varied considerably. Sediments older than 250 million years (pre-breakup) are all continental sediments while those younger than 250 million years are predominantly marine. 
_3M. How and when did mountains form?
_This is an ambiguous question because it depends on accepted theory. In 2000, Ollier and Pain noted in their book on mountains that a distinction must be made between orogeny, which deals with the formation of fold belts, and uplift to form mountains. This distinction is not always clear in conventional tectonic usage. In their book Ollier and Pain showed that, in contrast to folding of rocks to form mountains, modern mountain building instead results from vertical uplift to form “plateaux”—large areas of relatively flat uplifted land surfaces—rather than from horizontal compression.
Ollier and Pain provided many examples from major mountain ranges throughout the world to show that most mountains are, in fact, relatively young (as young as ~2 million years) eroded plateaux, with very little to do with the earlier folding event, or events, as preserved in the rocks below the plateaux. These plateaux were seen as once been relatively flat, low-lying eroded surfaces, such as now seen along many continental margins. As a result of vertical uplift, the ancient rivers and streams of the time were then reactivated and new erosion surfaces proceeded to cut across older folded bedrock structures to form new plateaux and eroded escarpments.
_4F. How and when did the Earth form?
_Sort this one out yourself Lloyd.
_Increasing radius small Earth modelling studies show that the size of the early-Archaean Earth was around 27 percent of the present Earth radius—a similar size to the present Moon. At that time the entire primordial Earth crust comprised granite and volcanic rocks with very little sedimentary rocks and no large oceans. It is speculated from the crustal and mantle temperature studies of others that the pre-Archaean Earth—times older than 4,000 million years ago—may have been incandescent, that is, hot enough to remain molten without crystallisation to form a stable crust or dateable minerals and rocks.
_In order for the primordial Earth, and by inference the Moon, to be incandescent during pre-Archaean times it is speculated that the Earth-Moon system was located much closer to the primitive young Sun than it is now. The very much reduced Earth-Moon size and mass existing at that time would insist that centrifugal forces and angular momentum would have been vastly different to what they are now and hence this suggestion may be plausible. By Archaean to early-Proterozoic times the Earth-Moon system may have then moved sufficiently far away from the influence of the Sun’s surface temperature and gravity to cool and form a stable primitive crust. Sufficiently far to also lower Earth-Moon surface temperatures enough to retain liquid water on the primitive Earth surface while still retaining a high residual geothermal gradient in the mantle.
_During the distant pre-Archaean times—an indeterminate time span of maybe billions of years—it is further speculated that the Earth-Moon system may have also been originally combined as a single molten planet. By combining the volume of the present Moon and the volume of the early-Archaean Earth, the pre-Archaean Earth-Moon system is readily calculated to have been approximately 2,100 kilometres radius prior to separation. At, or sometime prior to 4,540 million years ago, the Earth and Moon may have then separated. It is envisaged that this separation occurred as a result of gravitational instability of the more basaltic molten surface layer of the primitive incandescent Earth-Moon, possibly as a result of a high rotational velocity and centrifugal forces, forming a double planet. This mechanism is described in conventional literature as fission of the Moon from the Earth’s primitive basaltic crust through centrifugal forces occurring during a period of high angular momentum of the Earth–Moon system. A high angular momentum and rotational velocity may again add support to the suggestion that the Earth-Moon system was originally located much closer to the primitive young Sun.
_It is further speculated that, once separated, this double planet scenario would have originally comprised two bodies, the Earth and the Moon, of approximately equal size—around 1,700 kilometres radius—and in close proximity co-rotating around each other as they do today. Currently, the Earth and Moon are continuing to move further apart and are now separating at a measured rate of 38 millimetres per year. It is also feasible to consider that the Earth-Moon system is continuing to move further away from the Sun. This, more passive separation process, in contrast to a speculative impact event, may then go a long way to explain why the Moon is currently in synchronous, albeit retrograde rotation around the Earth, always showing the same face to the Earth.
_Cheers James

RE: Do I have your model right?
Wednesday, January 3, 2018 10:30 PM
From: mike@newgeology.us
To: "lloyd kinder" <lkindr@yahoo.com>
1C. How and when did the largely granitic continents and the largely basaltic ocean basins form?
SD: Earth cooling formed basalt shell.  Later, a planetesimal collision with Earth formed Moon and protocontinent.  1-4000 million years ago.
2S. How and when did sedimentary rock strata form?
SD: Paleozoic/Mesozoic strata formed during global flood caused by meteorite swarm <40,000 years ago.  Cenozoic strata formed during the SD event, <11,500 years ago.
3M. How and when did mountains form?
SD: Sliding continental crust <11,500 years ago by impulse, braking, and collision.
4F. How and when did the Earth form?
SD: ~4.6 Ga Nebular Hypothesis Gravitational Accretion

RE: Do I have your model right?
Wednesday, January 3, 2018 8:13 PM
From: "Doug Ettinger" <dougettinger@verizon.net>
To: "'lloyd kinder'" <lkindr@yahoo.com>
_Hello Lloyd, I am not sure what 200-0 Ma means.  For myself bya is billions of years ago and mya is millions of years ago.  There is no easy way to neatly place planetary events into a table form for my hypothesis.  I will attempt to give a brief timeline.
^ The solar system with its pristine planets started according to consensus science at 4.6 bya.  The planets may have formed at slightly different times from more parallel Z-pinches surrounding the Sun.
^ The first basaltic crust on Earth formed about 4.0 bya.  It volatiles were preserved by having its orbit originally between Mars and Jupiter - much farther away from the Sun's T-Tauri phase..
^ Then the planet was struck by a Ganymede-size rogue body about 3.9 bya (roughly the date of the Late Heavy Bombardment)
^ Material oozed from the impact crater to create a mega-continent (mixed with volatiles from the impactor to create a granitic lighter crust) and crack and expand the original crust starting the beginning of plate tectonics and continental drift.  The oldest cratons on Earth's continents are dated to 3.6 bya.
^ Debris from impact kept being swept up by the Moon and falling back to Earth until about 3.0 bya.  Then the Moon's mares and Earth's surface cooled enough for the crusts to solidify.  The steam from the escaping volatiles of the impactor and Earth's original volatiles condensed to form the oceans and create the atmosphere.
^ For the next billion years to about 2.0 bya continental drift and crustal rifts were accelerated due the combination of tidal acceleration forces of a closer Moon, residual heat from the impact, a formation of a slippery layer of trapped volatiles (the Moho layer), and exothermic chemical reactions of mixing different volatiles between the Earth and the impactor.
^ Sedimentary rock structures  were created by the layering of dust and ash on both land and sea from mega-volcano eruptions.
^ This building process of the planetary surface was interrupted both intermittently and periodically by the external electrical discharges from close encounters of the Nemesis star system every 3600 years. 
^ Layering of various sedimentary rock layers over all ages was caused by volcanic dust; water and wind erosion; electrical arc welding of materials; and meteor strikes. Certain layers contain huge amounts of fossilized animals denoting certain geological eras of mass extinctions.  These catastrophes were due to the returning Nemesis star system bringing violent electrical arc discharges, increased volcanism, crustal displacements and tsunami-type global flooding.  The largest recorded mass extinctions have occurred about every 26 my for the past 250,000 million years/
^ Mountain and plateau building over all ages was caused by continental drift and either the subduction or crashing together of plates which prevented the continental crusts from being eroded to sea level.  The poor distribution of the continents on the spinning Earth's surface causes them to hunt for an equilibrium of balance.
^ Large reservoirs of trapped volatiles over all ages created geological hot spots (island chains) and small continental-size trapps such as the Deccan in India.
^ I have chronicled the Nemesis star system visits for the past 20,000 years in www.ettingerjournals.com/dbe_mankind.shtml
^ The most well known visit in man's memory is the Younger Dryas which I date at 11,500 years ago or 9500 BC.  The Younger Dryas supposedly started 12,900 years ago, but this is error because the radio carbon dating constant C14/C12 was very depressed.  The span is very short with most of the period being involved by recovery.
_Lloyd, my timeline does not apply very well to your specific questions.  But, it is the best that I can do. I am really impressed with your diligence.
_All the best, Doug

Re: Do I have your model right?
Thursday, January 4, 2018 3:04 AM
From: "David Noel" <davidn@aoi.com.au>
To: "lloyd kinder" <lkindr@yahoo.com>
Cc: "James Maxlow" <james.maxlow@bigpond.com>
_Hi Lloyd -- -- My Earth-Expansion Model (described in EP302: The Earth-Expansion Model Part A: The Death of Plate Tectonics
<http://www.aoi.com.au/EP/EP302.htm> and EP303: The Earth-Expansion Model Part B: Answers to A Hundred Puzzles
<http://www.aoi.com.au/EP/EP303.htm>) is similar to James Maxlow's views, with the following exceptions.
_1) In my view, there is nothing RAISING James' and Cliff Ollier's "plateau mountains", doomed to be eroded to form mountain ranges. Instead, they are areas of the Earth's surface left behind while surrounding areas SINK down relatively, due to Equilibration (described in How Seafloor Spreading affects the level of oceans and seas: The Expansion Equilibration Model <http://www.aoi.com.au/bcw/Seafloor/index.htm>). We agree that frictional forces acting along the junctions of Earth Domains (something like tectonic plates, though that term is a misnomer) are responsible for mountain ranges like the Rockies and Andes.
_2) My model gives the REASON for Earth Expansion (See XT807: The Concore Model of planet and star interiors <http://www.aoi.com.au/Extracts/XT807.htm>), in contrast to other models. And this model doesn't involve any extra mass coming from anywhere.
_3) My model also explains how and why earthquakes occur (Finally, the True Origin of Earthquakes <http://www.aoi.com.au/bcw1/Finally/index.htm>) and, in particular, the source of the immense energies involved. No other model that I know of explains this.
_4) I also have a new model of how the Earth and other planets formed, quite different to the usual Planetary Protodisc idea (See P1: The Cosmic Smog model for solar system formation, and the nature of 'Dark Matter' <http://www.aoi.com.au/bcw1/Cosmic/index.htm>). This ties in very closely with the Concore Model in (2).
_Cheers, David.

Re: Do I have your model right?
Friday, January 5, 2018 12:24 PM
From: "Bruce Leybourne" <leybourneb@iascc.org>
To: "lloyd kinder" <lkindr@yahoo.com> Cc: rfarrar.lpool@virgin.net "Andrew Hall" <hallad1257@gmail.com>
_I don't think everything formed 200-0  or 200-3 Ma, don't really follow why this assumption is made...
_Looks like geologic history is out the window in this analysis....
_All the Best, Bruce Leybourne (IASCC)
Institute for Advanced Studies in Climate Change
12361 East Cornell Ave. Aurora, CO  80014 303.802.0848 www.iascc.org leybourneb@iascc.org

RE: Do I have your model right?
Friday, January 5, 2018 2:10 PM
From: "Robert Farrar" <rfarrar.lpool@virgin.net>
To: "'lloyd kinder'" <lkindr@yahoo.com> Cc: hallad1257@gmail.com leybourneb@iascc.org
_Hello Lloyd, I may be a solitary voice with regards to my answers to the questions you ask, nevertheless here goes…
_How and when did the largely granitic/sedimentary continents and the largely basaltic ocean basins form?
_Earth is essentially basaltic, what we now call continents formed by the granitization of the basaltic basement and ‘outgassing’ of silica. Granite as a singular rock is somewhat of a misnomer instead it refers to a group or family of similar rocks. The continental cratons may well have been sedimentary to begin with and gradually granitized, evidence for this are the accompanying migmatites found in the cratons plus many granites show evidence of a pre-existing structure. The 18th and 19th century view of ‘Plutonic’ granite is somewhat problematical.
_The process of granitization involved the presence of water- I guess you could say I’m a neo-Neptunist- so as sedimentary layers were deposited water was also accumulating. With time a global dichotomy developed geologists now see this dichotomy as two types of crust.
_How and when did sedimentary rock strata form?
_From what I have outlined above sedimentary rocks formed early in Earth’s history. Sedimentary rocks without fossils are ‘primary’ sedimentary rocks whilst those with fossils are reworked ‘primary’ sedimentary rocks.
How and when did mountains form?
_Mountains formed recently in Earth’s history (Pliocene, Pleistocene). As James Maxlow somewhat discourteously pointed out Ollier and Pain have done excellent research in this area. Mountains are due to in situ uplift and erosion, this process happened the world over during a well defined ‘recent’ period. My view is that this period was more recent than Ollier and Pain realise and involved electrical uplift and erosion.
_In 1963 Thomas Gold wrote: “The earth’s magnetic field could clearly not hold up the incoming gas, and it would indeed drive down to the atmospheric level where the gas pressure can resist the further flow. At that level the atmosphere is dense and the ionization that could be maintained would not result in a good conductivity. The incoming gas bringing its strong field into the virtually insulating atmosphere would then result in very large electric fields so directed that the resulting currents would maintain those fields. But in the atmosphere this can be done only by electrical breakdown. Since the ground is a good conductor such a breakdown is likely to take a path of breakdown through the entire thickness of the atmosphere on each side of the magnetic cloud being pressed in, and through the body of the earth from one site of breakdown to the other … This breakdown would be in the form of a series of sparks, burning for extended periods of time and carrying currents of hundreds of millions of amperes.”
_Gold envisaged a solar superstorm of extraordinary proportions impacting Earth’s electrical environment- the discharge path would travel from pole to pole “in the form of a series of sparks, burning for extended periods of time and carrying currents of hundreds of millions of amperes”. When we look at Earth’s north magnetic pole we see a polygonal pattern surrounding the continent of Antarctica (Saturn has a similar atmospheric hexagonal pattern at its north magnetic pole). The discharge paths then radiate outward generally toward the south magnetic pole on the North American continent- not too distant from the Arctic Ocean basin. Of course geologists do not see discharge paths, they see spreading centres. Where the circuit was not completed the current would have discharged into the Earth’s upper layers- lightning like- increasing Earth’s negative potential. Following from the works of Wal Thornhill the additional charge led to an increase of Earth’s internal polarization and subsequently G as experienced at the Earth’s surface.
_Writing in 'Marine Geomorphology' Chris Smoot observes: “The northern Mid-Atlantic Ridge (MAR) stacked profiles show the MAR to be shoaler at the crest tapering to low abyssal plains on the flanks. The various highs along the profiles are blocks, ridge-formed seamounts, or sundered plateaus. This is the standard acceptance of the ocean basin feature. Superimposed profiles of the MAR at 17o 30’N latitude and the front range of the Rocky Mountains at 39oN latitude show such remarkable similarity, that they must have been produced by the same tectonics.” (my emphasis)
_How and when did the Earth form?
_As much as I would like to know, this is unanswerable. In an infinite and eternal plasma universe Earth may be much older than the present consensus view- which uses a meteorite to date the Earth based on the hypothesis that both condensed from the same protostellar cloud, of course the Earth may be much younger than the present consensus view. If I had to choose between condensation from a gas cloud or expulsion from a gas-giant planet I’d choose the latter.
_Post Script
_I have viewed Andy’s very interesting presentations at thunderbolts.info- when a thought occurred to me- that’s not easy for the hard of thinking!
In the presentations Andy notes structures formed following lightning strikes in the ‘Four Corners’ region of the US. What caught my attention was his description of the resultant conical mound as being covered with pebbles of fused sand.
_Now consider the island of Surtsey. Surtsey formed in a commotion of fire and electricity:
img.gawkerassets.com/img/18ist7ga037ujjpg/ku-xlarge.jpg
_Now consider this from Louis Hissink:
lhcrazyworld.wordpress.com/2017/05/24/surtsey-island-sedimentology-conundrums/
_Is it possible that the boulders, cobbles and pebbles of Surtsey are analogous to the fused pebbles observed by Andy? Can we conclude that volcanoes form where ‘internal’ and ‘external’ lightning meet?
_Regards, Robert

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